studio design

coming soon

Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:27 am

From: "Dave Martin" <dave.martin@n...>
Date: Sat Feb 10, 2001 7:48 pm
Subject: Re: [acoustics] studio design

Well, you'd actually be making the control room sideways to the building,
which would make it 11.5 feet deep and maybe 15 feet wide. If you made a
narrow passageway of three feet wide, then your control room would only be
about 8 feet deep. The way that I was thinking, the doors would be opposite
the mixing board, which would give you a 'virtual' passage. If I had a
drawing program, I could probably draw out what I mean with much less effort
than trying to describe it. I don't know that you'd need to may anything
'Fully Absorbent', but it depend on the room and the sound that you wanted.

Dave Martin
DMA, Inc.
Nashville, TN
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:27 am

From: "john@t..." <rockin@b...>
Date: Sat Feb 10, 2001 7:03 am
Subject: Re: [acoustics] studio design

Dave Martin wrote:
>
> That's why I couldn't remember the name - I just thought of it as John's
> blue book (until he politely reminded me to give it back to him...)

i love ya man... :)

john
--
the little house that rocks
www.blackcabin.com
530-758-0595

"... it wasn't spelt the same way, but I was so inspired by the capacity of the
cooler
that we named the band after it." - Scott Trotter of lowboy - 5/00
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:29 am

From: "Danny Stinnett" <danny@p...>
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 1:37 am
Subject: Re: [acoustics] studio design

This sounds good to me. As far as soundproofing, I meant...do you have noisy
neighbors, do you have neighbors that will complain about noise...etc. Seems
like I read somewhere, that some of those type instruments don't put out a
lot of volume (indian instruments,I mean). If this is true, you need a very
quiet room in which to record them. HTH Danny
>: The entrance to the room is on one end, full open.
>: Could this info help you in answering my questions?
>
>THe biggest problems that I see is you'll want to be able to get from the
>outside into the control room without going through the tracking room (That
>way, someone making a delivery won't interfere with the recording), and
>ideally you would want to be able to get into the tracking room without
>going through the control room (think of musicians bringing in equipment -
>you don't want them banging into your equipment). Unfortunately, as the
room
>is only 11.5 feet wide, I don't really see a way to do that without making
>the control room very, very narrow.
>
>So my first guess, especially if the bathroom is in the same corner as the
>entrance, would be to make an entry hall/break room next to the front door,
>perhaps 8 feet wide, and then the control room, which would be the whole
>width of the building (11.5 feet wide and perhaps 15 feet in the other
>dimension. By the way, I would put the console and hard disk system on one
>side of that room, and the doors, one to the entry hall and one to the
>tracking room on the other side of the control room. In other words, don't
>think of looking over the top of the mixer into the tracking room, but
>instead, look sideways. This is often referred to as a 'side loaded'
control
>room; this is a popular approach for Russ Berger; you can see examples of
>side loaded rooms at www.rbdg.com. Then use the rest of the space for the
>tracking room.
>
>Of course, tomorrow, I might have another idea...
>
>Dave Martin
>DMA, Inc.
>Nashville, TN
>
>
>
>
>For more info, unsubscribe, large file uploads, ect:
http://www.studiotips.com
>Send small drawing files to dan@s...
>To Unsubscribe: Send email to
>acoustics-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:29 am

From: "Danny Stinnett" <danny@p...>
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 1:42 am
Subject: Re: [acoustics] can some one help me with a plan ,for a studio

Hi Ranjan, I would not want a totally dead studio. Very difficult to get
drums and even electric guitars to sound good in a dead room. Fact is, you
might be able to record your guitar tracks in the bathroom...try it, it's
been done before. HTH. Danny
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:31 am

From: Stephen Foster <oncourse@i...>
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 4:16 am
Subject: Re: [acoustics] can some one help me with a plan ,for a studio

That's a fact. And bathrooms make great reverb chambers. The Eurhythmics
used their apartment bathroom for their 1st & 3rd albums' reverb. Our
studio proper is 21' X 19', has concrete floors and 18' ceilings, and the
drums sound killer in there. Live, live, live. Why take a big sounding drum
set, suck the sound out of the room, record the puny drum sound, and then
try to recreate a big sounding set via effects? It's a duh.

sf
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:32 am

From: "Throatlatch Records" <ranjan@t...>
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 3:52 am
Subject: Re: [acoustics] can some one help me with a plan ,for a studio

Hi Danny!
Recording Guitars in the Bathroom is a good option and I've even tried it at
home!
The studio space I have right now is totally live and I can tailor it to
suit my needs, so I want to do it just right, with minimum amount of
treatment.
Its basically a shop space, having shops on either side of the walls. The
walls are 5" Brick walls. That means I'll have to have some isolation stuff
on both these walls, right. ( I've mailed the drawing of the floorplan at
dan@s... ).The back is open air space, and front is also open air
space. What isolation technique would you advice me for this?
Also, Im interested in getting the right setup in the control room. I've
read that for proper early reflection, you need at least 12' behind the
mixing panel, which obviously, I can't afford here. What is a way around for
that?

Thanx.
Ranjan
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:32 am

From: "Throatlatch Records" <ranjan@t...>
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 4:31 am
Subject: Re: [acoustics] studio design

Hi Dave!
I have totally understood the concept that you want to convey. I'd just like
you to know that the entrance to the place is from the 11.5 side opposite to
the bathroom. With side loaded C/R we wil have around 5' behind the mixing
desk, which will also be the virtual passage, right? Just a few doubts, I'd
like to clarify...
In that case won't the some sound be likely to creep into the tracking Room
through the doors. In case of seperate passageway, we would be having a
sound lock, or won't it matter so much? (I've posted the drawing of the
floor plan to dan@s...)

According to Malcolm's article on Control Room design, you should have a
minimum of 12 ' behind the mixing console, for the early reflection to come
back at the appropriate time. Here, we'll just be having 5'. What is the
solution for this problem?
What treatment would you advice for my rear wall? The trend here is to make
wood frames on the wall 6"-12" deep and stuff it with glasswool, cover it on
the outside with some cloth material like Jute etc. on all walls. Is that
really required? I really like the concept of using diffusers, but don't
know how to go about it. Could I have some pivoted panels which are live on
one end and absorbent on the other, and can be rotated to whatever angle
required on that wall, so that if other people want to use the studio, they
can have the acoustic adjusted to what they are used to? I'm really
interested in having the right acoustics done for the control Room, so that
I can mix and master on true sound. Hard to achieve, but we can always
strive towards it, can't we?

Also, will we be using a mid field monitor, or a near field monitor? Could
you recommend something for my application. How is Tannoy Reveal Active?

Thanx.
Ranjan
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:33 am

From: "Danny Stinnett" <danny@p...>
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 6:36 am
Subject: Re: [acoustics] can some one help me with a plan ,for a studio

Ranjan, I don't know what you can do with such a small area. From info I
have seen, you just need a certain amount of space for bass to develop and
for your early reflection gap to sound right. Maybe someone else will jump
in here...Has anyone tried some of those RPG, Auralex, etc...type
diffusors?? Would this help him?? May have to do some bass trapping since
the room is small...Sorry I can't help you more. Danny
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:34 am

From: "Dave Martin" <dave.martin@n...>
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 5:54 am
Subject: Re: [acoustics] studio design

Once Dan has your floor plan posted, then you'll get some better information
than just me guessing. (Actually, you'll have a bunch of other people
guessing as well...) But it will make more sense, I think. But with
nearfields and a small mixer, that means that you'll only be sitting 3-4
feet from one wall, which will give you 7-8 feet behind you to the other
wall. I've worked in several studios with less space than this behind the
engineer, and it seems to work OK. I actually see the front wall heavily
treated than the rear wall in this scenario, by the way, since you're trying
to minimize acoustic coupling to the wall behind the monitors.

Dave Martin
DMA, Inc.
Nashville, TN
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:34 am

From: "Throatlatch Records" <ranjan@t...>
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 7:43 am
Subject: Re: [acoustics] can some one help me with a plan ,for a studio

Hi danny!
Your mail is slightly discouraging, but I'm sure there can be some way out!
From what you say, I understand that there will not be enough Bass perceived
in the Control Room. So we have to trap and enhance the bass response,
rather than try and trap it. Is that correct?
RPG, Auralex etc are not available here in India, so I guess, I'll have to
make similar stuff, if someone can give me a decent design for it. Are the
diffuser pics in the studiotips.com site similar to what we are talking
about?
The floor is marble tiled. Will that contribute to the control room sound,
or be harmful?
If I make the control room 18' long, I could have 12' behind me , which
should be enough for early reflections. This will give me 12' for the
tracking room. What do you say? Please don't give up on me. I am desperate
on this!!!!

Ranjan
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:35 am

From: "Throatlatch Records" <ranjan@t...>
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 7:50 am
Subject: Re: [acoustics] can some one help me with a plan ,for a studio

What have you done for your walls? Have you treated the entire walls, or
only in areas where absorption or diffusion is required? Also what do you do
to the ceilings? Just sonex tiles or plywod tiles used at proper deflecting
angle will do the job, or do you have to do more?

Ranjan
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:35 am

From: "Throatlatch Records" <ranjan@t...>
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 8:04 am
Subject: Re: [acoustics] studio design

The wall on which the near field monitors are fixed, will be 4' from me,
which makes the monitor front about 3' from me. Will that be enough space,
or do we need more? Is this the wall that should be heavily trated to make
it fully absorbent, and the wall behind me when I sit at the mixer , be
treated with only diffusers?
Ranjan
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:35 am

From: "Nestor Natividade" <somperfeito@s...>
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 11:54 am
Subject: RES: [acoustics] studio design

Dear Martin,
Where can I find Surround Pro ? Do you have its URL ?
Regards
Nestor
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:36 am

From: Stephen Foster <oncourse@i...>
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 1:55 pm
Subject: Re: [acoustics] can some one help me with a plan ,for a studio

My take here is that there's X amount of space, and you're sacrificing the
control room for tracking room space. That's backwards in my opinion. I'd
look to see how much tracking room space is left after you get your 12' set
for the control room. If you don't have reality in your mix position,
you'll probably never go beyond demo mixes.

sf
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:36 am

From: SRF7@a...
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 2:14 pm
Subject: Re: [acoustics] studio design

In a message dated 2/9/01 12:55:29 PM Eastern Standard Time,
ranjan@t... writes:

> Please help me!!!
>
> Ranjan

Start with a couple of the books listed in Dan's web site:

<A HREF="http://www.studiotips.com/">http://www.studiotips.com/</A>

The Everest books would be a good start.

Calculate your proposed room designs acoustically and then calculate acoustic
treatments to compensate ... share your proposals here, and perhaps retain an
engineer to check your math and help you refine the design before building.

There are a couple of basic concepts that if understood will greatly improve
your results ... like setting room dimensions in anti-ratiotic proportions to
avoid concentrating the room modes at common frequencies ... all stuff you
can figure out with basic arithmetic.

Treatments need not be based on any fancy materials .... burlap, plywood,
upholstery batting .... simple common materials will suffice.

Corning 703 is a compressed fiberglass board approximately 3.5 lbs. per cubic
foot in density. Cotton balls stuffed in a burlap feed sack, or hay bales
stacked against a wall would work just as well, but fiberglass board comes in
convenient sizes and shapes, bugs and mice don't find it appealing, and its
fireproof ... so its generally preferred .. nothing magic about it though. .
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:37 am

From: SRF7@a...
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 2:18 pm
Subject: Re: [acoustics] studio design

In a message dated 2/9/01 5:10:32 PM Eastern Standard Time,
pro-found@m... writes:

> Never confirmed it myself but hey, if it smells like a cat, looks like a cat
> and
> miauws like a cat, it probably is a cat.
>
> Arjan Sinnige

I thought it was a duck?

Scott
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:37 am

From: "Dave Martin" <dave.martin@n...>
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 2:37 pm
Subject: Re: [acoustics] studio design

----- Original Message -----
From: "Nestor Natividade" <somperfeito@s...>

: Dear Martin,
: Where can I find Surround Pro ? Do you have its URL ?
: Regards
: Nestor

Yep. http://www.surroundpro.com/

Dave Martin
DMA, Inc.
Nashville, TN
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:38 am

From: SRF7@a...
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 2:54 pm
Subject: Re: [acoustics] studio design

In a message dated 2/10/01 8:29:23 AM Eastern Standard Time,
ranjan@t... writes:

> Could I make a passage 3' wide adjoining the Control Room to enter the
> Tracking Room.
> That would make it narrower still, but could we live with it?
> Ranjan

Or knock a hole in the wall and hang a second door for a back way in.

Scott
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:39 am

From: SRF7@a...
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 4:02 pm
Subject: Re: [acoustics] can some one help me with a plan ,for a studio

In a message dated 2/10/01 11:34:34 PM Eastern Standard Time,
ranjan@t... writes:

> Its basically a shop space, having shops on either side of the walls. The
> walls are 5" Brick walls. That means I'll have to have some isolation stuff
> on both these walls, right. ( I've mailed the drawing of the floorplan at
> dan@s... ).The back is open air space, and front is also open air
> >> space. What isolation technique would you advice me for this?

On the sides, a new wall on new studs in front of the masonry ... shoot for a
5 to 6" inch (125 to 150 mm) dead air gap. put a bit of insulation in
betwenn the new studs, and caulk the new wall up so that it is air tight

At the open ends a double stud wall with sound locks and double doors.

> Also, Im interested in getting the right setup in the control room. I've
> read that for proper early reflection, you need at least 12' behind the
> mixing panel, which obviously, I can't afford here. What is a way around for
> that?

Dead front wall ... desk flush to dead wall .... live rear wall with lots of
diffusion. Maybe turn the C room sideways to the tracking room like Dave
sez. Make the C-room small, you need all the volume you can squeeze out of
the space for your tracking room (6,000 cubic feet is an optimal minimum and
you aint got it, so hang onto all you can). Check out the diffusion sketchs
at Dan's page and figure out what you can most easily build (polys are easy
but not super effective) ... you need lots of diffusion to artificially
increase the acoustic size of the tracking room, try to do this without
taking out all of the reverb time.

It would be a great improvement if you could obtain a space with twice the
width ... example: a 20' wide, 27' deep, 11.5' tall space is just over 6,000
cubic feet. Such a space could make a nice little tracking room ... you are
at half that size and the laws of physics are working against you.

Scott R. Foster
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Postby archive » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:41 am

From: SRF7@a...
Date: Sun Feb 11, 2001 4:36 pm
Subject: Re: [acoustics] studio design

In a message dated 2/10/01 11:36:18 PM Eastern Standard Time,
ranjan@t... writes:

> I'm really
> interested in having the right acoustics done for the control Room, so that
> I can mix and master on true sound. Hard to achieve, but we can always
> strive towards it, can't we?
>
> Also, will we be using a mid field monitor, or a near field monitor? Could
> you recommend something for my application. How is Tannoy Reveal Active?
>
> Thanx.
> Ranjan

Maybe build a control room closet (very small room) for tracking .... put
your gear on wheels and move it to the tracking room for mix down work which
you do after the tracking is complete... that way your acoustic space is your
mixing room .. the closet is just so you can hear what you are recording.
Pain in the ass ... but you just don't have room two big rooms

Scott R. Foster
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