Paul's STUDIO BUILD DIARY

Post and discuss acoustic topics, Studio design, construction, and soundproofing here

Postby SJ_Digriz » Sat May 14, 2005 9:32 pm

TheArchitect wrote:
Paul Woodlock wrote:
TheArchitect wrote:Just dump it all into a PDF file for $3 a download or something.


Not a bad idea. With dongle copy protection of course ;) ;)


When did you start working for Steinberg?
:wink:  :bang  :D  :D  :D


Let me guess, the first version will have a cover and an index with 400 pages of "This page intentionall left blank".

You will then patch it 3 weeks later with several hundred pages of text, only to have many readers point out that a good bit of the updated text is really a partial transcript of Faulty Towers.  You will promise to fix it in the next release as well as add NEW AND EXCITING text that we haven't seen before.  But, the publishing will cost too much so you will charge an extra $5 for that patch, which we pay for but then is delayed 2 months.  When we finally get it we discover that Adobe has changed PDF formats and we can't read the update unless we buy the PAY version of the Adobe reader.   Then we find out that it won't run with the dongle.  When we finally get that all sorted out we find out that INDEED there is some tremendous new content, but all the relevant bits from the original release have either been changed, abridged or removed altogether leaving the entire thing a little out of context............................
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Postby Paul Woodlock » Sat May 14, 2005 9:36 pm

Bob wrote:Hi Paul:

What's the
a) approximate 3D internal dimensions of your room, to the baffles/soffets.
b) volume of the room, to the baffles/soffets.
c) surface area of the absorbtion (room side)

I'd like to compare it to http://www.bobgolds.com/Mode/RoomModes.htm
the
1) RT60 (ITU Control Room Recommended):
2) Absorbtion to achieve RT60:
lines.


Greetings Bob

DImensions are 4m long 4.3m wide 2.16m high

Volume = 37.152m3

Surface area of absorption unknown. And while I feel this exhausted and due to the complexity of the shapes, is likely to remain so for the next couple of days at least. Sorry :(  :oops:

I can say I've used about 23 to 25% of the room vlume as absorption ( Including portatraps ) if that helps.


Edit: I just checked your Room Modes Page. It's certainly developing nicely. I was pleased I got no REDS! :)

And I now know I should avoid the chords EbMaj and Ebmin :)

Paul
Last edited by Paul Woodlock on Sat May 14, 2005 9:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Bob » Sat May 14, 2005 9:44 pm

Thank's Paul.
I look forward to your surface area measurement on some future day.
I'm hoping it's 358 ft^2 (33 m^2)

Room Dimensions: Length=4.3 m, Width=4 m, Height=2.16 m
RT60 (ITU Control Room Recommended): 179 ms
Absorbtion to achieve RT60: 358 sabins

Edit: I just checked your Room Modes Page. It's certainly developing nicely. I was pleased I got no REDS
You did get a Walker dimensions warning though -- but with this much absorbtion I think it neither matters nor is accurate.
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Postby Paul Woodlock » Sat May 14, 2005 10:00 pm

Bob wrote:Thank's Paul.
I look forward to your surface area measurement on some future day.


I will do it at some point, but I really am too exhausted. I haven't even got the energy to finish designing my main desk at the moment.


Room Dimensions: Length=4.3 m, Width=4 m, Height=2.16 m
RT60 (ITU Control Room Recommended): 179 ms


I just checked my ETF file from the recent tests.  

RT60

50Hz -200Hz = 160ms  +/- 20ms
200Hz - 20kHz = 100ms  +/- 2ms

Absorbtion to achieve RT60: 358 sabins


Absorption  used: LOTS!!! :D :D


Paul
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Postby Paul Woodlock » Sat May 14, 2005 10:04 pm

SJ_Digriz wrote:
TheArchitect wrote:
Paul Woodlock wrote:
TheArchitect wrote:Just dump it all into a PDF file for $3 a download or something.


Not a bad idea. With dongle copy protection of course ;) ;)


When did you start working for Steinberg?
:wink:  :bang  :D  :D  :D


Let me guess, the first version will have a cover and an index with 400 pages of "This page intentionall left blank".

You will then patch it 3 weeks later with several hundred pages of text, only to have many readers point out that a good bit of the updated text is really a partial transcript of Faulty Towers.  You will promise to fix it in the next release as well as add NEW AND EXCITING text that we haven't seen before.  But, the publishing will cost too much so you will charge an extra $5 for that patch, which we pay for but then is delayed 2 months.  When we finally get it we discover that Adobe has changed PDF formats and we can't read the update unless we buy the PAY version of the Adobe reader.   Then we find out that it won't run with the dongle.  When we finally get that all sorted out we find out that INDEED there is some tremendous new content, but all the relevant bits from the original release have either been changed, abridged or removed altogether leaving the entire thing a little out of context............................


hehe :)

Actually I'll start a support forum where millions of readers will then post, aggressively blaming any bugs in the book for their inability to write great songs, or their inabilty to be assertive enough to stop their wives wearing the trousers in the house :D :D


Paul
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Postby OPUS_Music » Sat May 14, 2005 10:05 pm

SJ_Digriz wrote:
TheArchitect wrote:
Paul Woodlock wrote:
TheArchitect wrote:Just dump it all into a PDF file for $3 a download or something.


Not a bad idea. With dongle copy protection of course ;) ;)


When did you start working for Steinberg?
:wink:  :bang  :D  :D  :D


Let me guess, the first version will have a cover and an index with 400 pages of "This page intentionall left blank".

You will then patch it 3 weeks later with several hundred pages of text, only to have many readers point out that a good bit of the updated text is really a partial transcript of Faulty Towers.  You will promise to fix it in the next release as well as add NEW AND EXCITING text that we haven't seen before.  But, the publishing will cost too much so you will charge an extra $5 for that patch, which we pay for but then is delayed 2 months.  When we finally get it we discover that Adobe has changed PDF formats and we can't read the update unless we buy the PAY version of the Adobe reader.   Then we find out that it won't run with the dongle.  When we finally get that all sorted out we find out that INDEED there is some tremendous new content, but all the relevant bits from the original release have either been changed, abridged or removed altogether leaving the entire thing a little out of context............................


...and then of course some bright spark will crack the copy protection and we'll get people all over the world following Paul's words of wisdom to the letter, except of course because it's a crack instead of ending up with a fantastic studio, they'll end up with something looking like Blue Peter's version of the Thunderbird's Island ...........!!!!   :lol:
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Postby Paul Woodlock » Sat May 14, 2005 10:19 pm

oh and Bob, it might be interesting to note that my current tempory studio ( Spare bedroom ) has an RT60 vlaue of:


80Hz - 125Hz = 120ms +/- 15ms
125Hz - 20kHz = 75ms +/- 2ms

And that is treated with a bunch of duvets and sleeping bags.

This room also even has a slightly better frequency response from 200Hz upwards compared to the new place. Altough the new studio can't be beaten on the bass response.

My current room is really quite good in the grand scheme of things, but the new place sounds MUCH BETTER.

Which goes to show that Duvetscan work. but they look shit. :)


Paul
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Postby Paul Woodlock » Sun May 15, 2005 2:27 am

Sunday 15th May 2005 3:14am

Greetings! :)

'Bout time for a Dairy entry I think :)  :8  8O

Actually a DIARY entry might be better. I don't think a 'dairy entry' is much use in a forum. I mean I couldn't really insert a pint of milk into the Diary now could I? Well I suppose I could try! :)

First of all, I wish to annouce that I feel really exhausted at the moment.  The build has really cought up with me, and not actually physically building for the last days has, I guess, brought this on.

Still I must press on. I can have that 3 week long sleep once it's finished

Apart from trying to find the energy to finish designing the Main Desk, I've been pottering about testing paint on bits of MDF, and I've come to the conclusion that I DEFINITELY need to spray the paint on.   The finish from brushing was, in a word, well in two words... FUCKING CRAP!!!!  :bang

I had a look round the suppliers, and I can get a Compressor and spray gun for about £130. Ok, not too bad. But then Woman reminds me she bought a small hand electric spray gun for about £20 last year ( Which in typical fashion she's never used ;) - Cant resist a bargain  :roll:  :twisted: ) And all looked promisingly cool!

This little spray gun may not be upto the job of all my worktops and panels. But there's only one way to find out!!! And I'll give it a blast asap.

Anyway... The Main Desk!!!    I'm getting there! Honest!   Whatever, I REALLY NEED TO GET THERE ASAP. It's the last big build.

I'm almost sure I've got it right. The current design is the last beta version before I come up with a Release Candidate.

I'll post some Autocad piccies and sleep on it, and hopefully tommorrow energy permitting, I can finalise things, and transfer the dimensions to scruffy bits of A4 paper so I can go and make a start building the damn thing.

byeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee for now :)


Paul
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Postby Paul Woodlock » Sun May 15, 2005 2:28 am

..
Attachments
Studio Desk Front.jpg
Studio Desk Front.jpg (48.65 KiB) Viewed 8248 times
Studio Desk Back.jpg
Studio Desk Back.jpg (61.35 KiB) Viewed 8247 times
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Postby Scott R. Foster » Sun May 15, 2005 4:02 pm

Ground Control to Major Paul, your circuits dead, there's something wrong.

Can you hear me Major Paul?
SRF
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Postby Paul Woodlock » Sun May 15, 2005 4:15 pm

I'mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm sitting in a tin can!!
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Postby stickjam » Sun May 15, 2005 8:02 pm

TheArchitect wrote:
Paul Woodlock wrote:
TheArchitect wrote:Just dump it all into a PDF file for $3 a download or something.


Not a bad idea. With dongle copy protection of course ;) ;)


When did you start working for Steinberg?
:wink:  :bang  :D  :D  :D


With the Avid/Digidesign acquisition of Steinberg by way of Pinnacle, the PDF wouldn't need a dongle.  However to read it, you'd have to buy a high-quality-yet-proprietary Acrobat plug-in (or download a really old one for free) that requires a dedicated high-quality-yet-proprietary-and-otherwise-useless $8,999.99 PCI card to run the plug-in.  :roll:

--Bob
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Postby Paul Woodlock » Sun May 15, 2005 9:25 pm

Yamaha now own Steinberg.

Thankgod Avid didn't aquire them!!
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Postby LFO » Mon May 16, 2005 12:29 am

Hey Paul,
Sorry to hear you are so tired.  I'll raise a can of Red Bull to you in the morning when I go running. :)

A quick question for you.  I'm tired of the table I've been using for my DAW and have been drawing up some various new designs for a new table.  I've been applying what I have been reading on this and other forums to see what I can do to improve the acoustics of the room I am using.  (You may recall telling me about the mirror trick.  I used it and and it worked like a charm!)

So may people say that early reflections are a big problem.  Reflections from the desk top and from computer monitors seem to be main culprits.  Hence, I have been playing with designs that minimize both (at least I think they do).  However, when I look at pictures of studios, home studios, etc. I find that  many people have their  audio monitors next to or behind their computer monitors.  All of the big studios have wide desks to handle mixing boards,etc.  Finally, I see in your studio that you will have your 3 computer monitors sitting plumb in the middle of the audio monitor /  mixing engineer triangle.  So I have to ask, is this not as big an issue as I thought?  I'd rather not spend time trying to optimize something that in the long run will not matter that much.

Thanks and get some rest!!!   :)

-LFO
If I knew music like I know computers, I'd be a freakin' Mozart ;)
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Postby Paul Woodlock » Mon May 16, 2005 1:06 am

LFO wrote:Hey Paul,
Sorry to hear you are so tired.  I'll raise a can of Red Bull to you in the morning when I go running. :)

A quick question for you.  I'm tired of the table I've been using for my DAW and have been drawing up some various new designs for a new table.  I've been applying what I have been reading on this and other forums to see what I can do to improve the acoustics of the room I am using.  (You may recall telling me about the mirror trick.  I used it and and it worked like a charm!)

So may people say that early reflections are a big problem.  Reflections from the desk top and from computer monitors seem to be main culprits.  Hence, I have been playing with designs that minimize both (at least I think they do).  However, when I look at pictures of studios, home studios, etc. I find that  many people have their  audio monitors next to or behind their computer monitors.  All of the big studios have wide desks to handle mixing boards,etc.  Finally, I see in your studio that you will have your 3 computer monitors sitting plumb in the middle of the audio monitor /  mixing engineer triangle.  So I have to ask, is this not as big an issue as I thought?  I'd rather not spend time trying to optimize something that in the long run will not matter that much.

Thanks and get some rest!!!   :)

-LFO


Greetings LFO

I've got the best compromise I can.

I've got the computer monitors sitting low enough to not obscure the studio monitors. And although the desk is indeed sitting where it can reflect straight at my ears. The monitors will act to block this. Although the sound ( mids and upwards ) will diffract around them.

I'm just hoping it doesn't have any or too much adverse effects.

I do intend to put some absorption behind the desk ( OMG!! - not more!!!? :D :D )

:)


Paul
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Postby Suntower » Mon May 16, 2005 7:55 pm

Paul Woodlock wrote:You know! A bit like your self produced and self promoted albums.


---My records -have- done quite well. There's a distinct chance that I'll be making more dough from music this year than writing code. (Interpret that as great prosperity or poverty---your call.)

But I never kid myself that I do it as well as 'the pros'. People buy my shit in spite of my recording skills, not because of them. Similarly, your tome would benefit -greatly- from a professional editor. Perhaps you can get with Marc (AuxBuss) at some point for some direction. A good editor might take the load off and let you get back to what you do best.

AND ON A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT TOPIC....:

Something I've been thinking about since you got started. I think you're making a poor assumption with your big, heavy CRTs. It is inevitable that you'll end up (hopefully sooner rather than later) with LCDs. Have you considered this and what (if any) effect it will have on your design? Personally, I can't imagine using CRTs now---too heavy, hot, etc. I know they're expensive, but the real estate of the CRTs seems -significant- to your overall design. (And -no- I ain't offerin' 'money from America') Not trying to be snotty--I just wonder how (if at all) the CRTs affect your studio design and whether or not you should plan for them to -not- be there in the near future.

See you at the end of July...

---JC
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Postby Paul Woodlock » Mon May 16, 2005 8:35 pm

Greetings JC

I can't see replacing the CRTs with flat screens having too much effect on the sound. They'll simply sit in the same place. The diffraction around them will of course be different to the bulky CRTs, but I'm not unduely worried. :)


Paul
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Postby Bob » Mon May 16, 2005 9:03 pm

Paul:
I can't see replacing the CRTs with flat screens having too much effect on the sound. They'll simply sit in the same place. The diffraction around them will of course be different to the bulky CRTs, but I'm not unduely worried
I was thinking of LCD screens for you as well. My first thought was that they could be tilted back. My second was that you could build your desk with holes for the LCD feet to lower the screens into the surface of the desk, lowering them from the sound path. My third was that they could be tilted back, but that might make them hard to read. My fourth was that they could be pushed further towards the back of the desk, moving them more between the speakers (paralax). My fifth was that with LCDs you could mount them in a vertical column 3 high, instead of horizontally.
Regards
Bob Golds
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Postby Suntower » Mon May 16, 2005 10:09 pm

You're the expert. The Big Cheese. Le Grande Fromage. El Hefe. Big Heap Studio Bwana.

What -I- noticed was:
1. Reduced ambient temperature in studio prox. 5C

2. Eliminated all manner of RFI.

3. Much easier to read from a distance.

FWIW: Here in the US of Capitalism, 19"ers have routinely dropped below $300....

OK. I'm done.

---JC


Paul Woodlock wrote:Greetings JC

I can't see replacing the CRTs with flat screens having too much effect on the sound. They'll simply sit in the same place. The diffraction around them will of course be different to the bulky CRTs, but I'm not unduely worried. :)


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Postby Paul Woodlock » Mon May 16, 2005 10:13 pm

Suntower wrote:You're the expert. The Big Cheese. Le Grande Fromage. El Hefe. Big Heap Studio Bwana.


And you are the expert in pointing out other important factors JC :)

What -I- noticed was:
1. Reduced ambient temperature in studio prox. 5C

2. Eliminated all manner of RFI.

3. Much easier to read from a distance.

FWIW: Here in the US of Capitalism, 19"ers have routinely dropped below $300....

OK. I'm done.

---JC


Absolutely! I can't afford to throw away 2 good monitors and cough up $900 for 2 flat screens at the moment though. I have other more important things to buy.

Although the ability to play guitar CLOSE to the monitors would be nice though :) ( when I learn to play it well enough that is :)

Paul
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